Comments on: Rowan socks it to ‘em! http://sbarnabas.com/blog/2009/11/21/rowan-socks-it-to-em/ the vague ramblings of the Revd. Fr. Edward Tomlinson SSC...... Thu, 29 Jul 2010 20:23:33 +0000 hourly 1 http://wordpress.org/?v=3.0 By: Steve http://sbarnabas.com/blog/2009/11/21/rowan-socks-it-to-em/comment-page-1/#comment-9186 Steve Mon, 23 Nov 2009 20:59:38 +0000 http://sbarnabas.com/blog/?p=1867#comment-9186 The ABC's comments were clearly meant for Anglican consumption. No Catholic commentator seems to regard them as being anything more than an uncharacteristic attempt at machismo. He was clearly playing to his own 'progressive' constituency that has presumably demanded a strong response and may become even more important in the near future. He sounded as though he was reading a script written by and for someone else (Katherine Jefferts Scary?) The ABC’s comments were clearly meant for Anglican consumption. No Catholic commentator seems to regard them as being anything more than an uncharacteristic attempt at machismo. He was clearly playing to his own ‘progressive’ constituency that has presumably demanded a strong response and may become even more important in the near future. He sounded as though he was reading a script written by and for someone else (Katherine Jefferts Scary?)

]]> By: Administrator http://sbarnabas.com/blog/2009/11/21/rowan-socks-it-to-em/comment-page-1/#comment-9166 Administrator Mon, 23 Nov 2009 14:22:05 +0000 http://sbarnabas.com/blog/?p=1867#comment-9166 Please refrain from the snide comments! One could also come to Saint Barnabas and enjoy Evensong, the English Missal with BCP prayer of institution, Marbeck and Shaw's Mass settings, Eastward facing Mass and enoy many favourite Anglican hymns. We are as I have often said Catholi-Anglicans - and that is why being forced to choose one or other is so profoundly painful. Why not come and join us one Sunday and see for yourself....for those who do all speak of a profound sense of holiness and sincerity. Blogs may not always convey that very well. We are what we are -not for political but historic reasons and simply want to remain so. Please refrain from the snide comments! One could also come to Saint Barnabas and enjoy Evensong, the English Missal with BCP prayer of institution, Marbeck and Shaw’s Mass settings, Eastward facing Mass and enoy many favourite Anglican hymns. We are as I have often said Catholi-Anglicans – and that is why being forced to choose one or other is so profoundly painful. Why not come and join us one Sunday and see for yourself….for those who do all speak of a profound sense of holiness and sincerity. Blogs may not always convey that very well. We are what we are -not for political but historic reasons and simply want to remain so.

]]> By: john http://sbarnabas.com/blog/2009/11/21/rowan-socks-it-to-em/comment-page-1/#comment-9165 john Mon, 23 Nov 2009 13:26:02 +0000 http://sbarnabas.com/blog/?p=1867#comment-9165 'We work together in love and mutual respect to hold on to what little is left of the Anglican Church we all love regardless of our differences.' I am 100% in agreement with this. John. ‘We work together in love and mutual respect to hold on to what little is left of the Anglican Church we all love regardless of our differences.’

I am 100% in agreement with this.

John.

]]> By: Anglican http://sbarnabas.com/blog/2009/11/21/rowan-socks-it-to-em/comment-page-1/#comment-9162 Anglican Mon, 23 Nov 2009 11:44:40 +0000 http://sbarnabas.com/blog/?p=1867#comment-9162 "There he would find a church which has long had the Pope’s photograph in the sacristary, which has only ever taught from the Catechism, uses Roman Rite as well as the Old English Missal, celebrates the Assumption of Mary into Heaven, proclaims the immaculate conception every Sunday at Benediction and which has never used Common Worship." Pusey must be spinning in his grave! Tell us, why again do you wish and claim to be a member of the Church of England? (apart from the chance to marry, nice house and better stipend?) “There he would find a church which has long had the Pope’s photograph in the sacristary, which has only ever taught from the Catechism, uses Roman Rite as well as the Old English Missal, celebrates the Assumption of Mary into Heaven, proclaims the immaculate conception every Sunday at Benediction and which has never used Common Worship.”

Pusey must be spinning in his grave!

Tell us, why again do you wish and claim to be a member of the Church of England? (apart from the chance to marry, nice house and better stipend?)

]]> By: Administrator http://sbarnabas.com/blog/2009/11/21/rowan-socks-it-to-em/comment-page-1/#comment-9161 Administrator Mon, 23 Nov 2009 09:06:08 +0000 http://sbarnabas.com/blog/?p=1867#comment-9161 Of course John, I would respond by inviting the Archbishop to Saint Barnabas. There he would find a church which has long had the Pope's photograph in the sacristary, which has only ever taught from the Catechism, uses Roman Rite as well as the Old English Missal, celebrates the Assumption of Mary into Heaven, proclaims the immaculate conception every Sunday at Benediction and which has never used Common Worship. I am fairly certain he would smile and aknowledge that we are EXACTLY the type of parish the ordinariate might serve well. I would have thought that you would have gleaned that much by now! As remarked by one parishioner yesterday the irony is that by moving we might stay the same- but by staying the same we are being forced to accept a doctrine that is not Catholic and the end of our expression of faith. I would also argue that my distress at the movement of the Church of England is not centred on the symptoms of women priests or anything else, rather that the CHurch is growing ever more liberal and protestant and thus not Catholic. For to me Catholicism involves doctrine and not just dressing up. Of course John, I would respond by inviting the Archbishop to Saint Barnabas. There he would find a church which has long had the Pope’s photograph in the sacristary, which has only ever taught from the Catechism, uses Roman Rite as well as the Old English Missal, celebrates the Assumption of Mary into Heaven, proclaims the immaculate conception every Sunday at Benediction and which has never used Common Worship. I am fairly certain he would smile and aknowledge that we are EXACTLY the type of parish the ordinariate might serve well. I would have thought that you would have gleaned that much by now!

As remarked by one parishioner yesterday the irony is that by moving we might stay the same- but by staying the same we are being forced to accept a doctrine that is not Catholic and the end of our expression of faith. I would also argue that my distress at the movement of the Church of England is not centred on the symptoms of women priests or anything else, rather that the CHurch is growing ever more liberal and protestant and thus not Catholic. For to me Catholicism involves doctrine and not just dressing up.

]]> By: John Marshall http://sbarnabas.com/blog/2009/11/21/rowan-socks-it-to-em/comment-page-1/#comment-9160 John Marshall Mon, 23 Nov 2009 00:28:47 +0000 http://sbarnabas.com/blog/?p=1867#comment-9160 Dear Fr Ed I should be interested in your response to the remarks made by the archbishop of Westminster the other day that [conversion to Roman Catholicism] “…must be a positive desire in the heart – not questions of the ordination of women to the episcopate, not questions of sexual ethics – but it must centre round the understanding of the role of the office of the bishop of Rome. A person must be embracing of that concrete aspect of Catholic life, which is the authority of the Holy See in the person of the pope, if they are going to make this journey with integrity. Nothing is envisaged in this provision of a minimalist approach to picking bits of the Catholic faith I like and seeing myself as a quasi-Catholic, not a real Catholic, under the umbrella of this constitution." You have made it abundantly clear on your blog, ever since I have been reading it, that you are unhappy about the direction in which the CofE is moving, and the main reason for your unhappiness is the imminent arrival of women bishops, and the Church’s failure to provide proper provision, as you see it, for those of an orthodox catholic faith. The issue of practising homosexual priests comes a close second. How would you have responded if the archbishop had made his comments to your face? Best wishes John Dear Fr Ed

I should be interested in your response to the remarks made by the archbishop of Westminster the other day that [conversion to Roman Catholicism] “…must be a positive desire in the heart – not questions of the ordination of women to the episcopate, not questions of sexual ethics – but it must centre round the understanding of the role of the office of the bishop of Rome. A person must be embracing of that concrete aspect of Catholic life, which is the authority of the Holy See in the person of the pope, if they are going to make this journey with integrity. Nothing is envisaged in this provision of a minimalist approach to picking bits of the Catholic faith I like and seeing myself as a quasi-Catholic, not a real Catholic, under the umbrella of this constitution.”

You have made it abundantly clear on your blog, ever since I have been reading it, that you are unhappy about the direction in which the CofE is moving, and the main reason for your unhappiness is the imminent arrival of women bishops, and the Church’s failure to provide proper provision, as you see it, for those of an orthodox catholic faith. The issue of practising homosexual priests comes a close second.

How would you have responded if the archbishop had made his comments to your face?

Best wishes

John

]]> By: Petros http://sbarnabas.com/blog/2009/11/21/rowan-socks-it-to-em/comment-page-1/#comment-9158 Petros Sun, 22 Nov 2009 17:06:22 +0000 http://sbarnabas.com/blog/?p=1867#comment-9158 Hello John, My remarks were intended generally and were not directed at anyone in particular although I understand that it may have appeared so due to the accident of timing when my contribution was posted. I haven't been been keeping a score card and have no idea if one person should feel more guilty than another, after all we all share our burden of guilt. I was merely making the plea that we work together in love and mutual respect to hold on to what little is left of the Anglican Church we all love regardless of our differences. Petros Hello John,
My remarks were intended generally and were not directed at anyone in particular although I understand that it may have appeared so due to the accident of timing when my contribution was posted.
I haven’t been been keeping a score card and have no idea if one person should feel more guilty than another, after all we all share our burden of guilt. I was merely making the plea that we work together in love and mutual respect to hold on to what little is left of the Anglican Church we all love regardless of our differences.
Petros

]]> By: Administrator http://sbarnabas.com/blog/2009/11/21/rowan-socks-it-to-em/comment-page-1/#comment-9157 Administrator Sun, 22 Nov 2009 14:06:38 +0000 http://sbarnabas.com/blog/?p=1867#comment-9157 I love your points John and agree with what you say, but it was not I who said damn them! Further ore father steele is no longer one of us. Just for the record. but yes emotions have run high a d it brings out the worst in all of us, last week I WAS enraged at the revision committee's report. Indeed am stl reeling that they offer nothing just when we need it. Rod thanks for the Clarification I see your point and agree with parts of it! I love your points John and agree with what you say, but it was not I who said damn them! Further
ore father steele is no longer one of us. Just for the record. but yes emotions have run high a d it brings out the worst in all of us, last week I WAS enraged at the revision committee’s report. Indeed am stl reeling that they offer nothing just when we need it.

Rod thanks for the Clarification I see your point and agree with parts of it!

]]> By: Rod http://sbarnabas.com/blog/2009/11/21/rowan-socks-it-to-em/comment-page-1/#comment-9156 Rod Sun, 22 Nov 2009 13:45:23 +0000 http://sbarnabas.com/blog/?p=1867#comment-9156 Again, sorry if my comments sounded like point scoring, they were not intended as such. I perhaps did not express myself very well – this was the point I was trying to make: Whatever you think of the Anglican Church as a whole, RW personally was badly treated by Rome in the way they introduced the constitution. So I was glad to see him on assertive form when he visited Rome. I also thought that his challenge – to ask exactly how the prohibition of WO enhances the Church, and how its breach would damage it – gets to the nub of the matter for those of us on the other side of the debate. That’s all. Again, sorry if my comments sounded like point scoring, they were not intended as such. I perhaps did not express myself very well – this was the point I was trying to make:

Whatever you think of the Anglican Church as a whole, RW personally was badly treated by Rome in the way they introduced the constitution. So I was glad to see him on assertive form when he visited Rome. I also thought that his challenge – to ask exactly how the prohibition of WO enhances the Church, and how its breach would damage it – gets to the nub of the matter for those of us on the other side of the debate. That’s all.

]]> By: john http://sbarnabas.com/blog/2009/11/21/rowan-socks-it-to-em/comment-page-1/#comment-9155 john Sun, 22 Nov 2009 13:00:48 +0000 http://sbarnabas.com/blog/?p=1867#comment-9155 Petros, You probably know that I am a liberal who wants to keep you with us and who has consistently argued for this on TA and elsewhere (including the church I go to, where as far as I know only one person [himself FiF] agrees with me). It seems, to me, however, that the wounding and taunting is far from one-directional. Consult me on an earlier thread here about the phrase 'Damn them' or the comments on almost any of Jeff Steel's postings or the remonstrations of 'Anglocatholicus' on an earlier thread. The truth is that we all ought to behave better in this regard - and that includes the Administrator of this blog. Petros,

You probably know that I am a liberal who wants to keep you with us and who has consistently argued for this on TA and elsewhere (including the church I go to, where as far as I know only one person [himself FiF] agrees with me). It seems, to me, however, that the wounding and taunting is far from one-directional. Consult me on an earlier thread here about the phrase ‘Damn them’ or the comments on almost any of Jeff Steel’s postings or the remonstrations of ‘Anglocatholicus’ on an earlier thread.

The truth is that we all ought to behave better in this regard – and that includes the Administrator of this blog.

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